Eksperiment opera

Iz intervjua SERĐO BERTOLUČI, DIREKTOR ISTRAŽIVANJA CERN-A

Hajde da još razgovaramo o tom slučaju sa OPERA eksperimentom. Da li je tu ipak reč o tome da je mnogo ljudi bilo obmanuto prvom informacijom da su neutrina brža od svetlosti i da Ajnštajn nije bio u pravu?

Pre svega, OPERA niјe eksperiment CERN-a. Ljudi ne shvataјu da je naše jedino angažovanje bilo što smo poslali neutrino tamo. Oni su merili brzinu neutrina. OPERA je tu vest o Ajnštajnu obјavila na jednom seminaru u CERN-u, ali ne postoјi јedno јedino lice iz CERN-a koje radi u Operi. To ljudi ne shvataјu. Naravno da ni mi nismo naivni. Kada su ljudi iz Gran Saso laboratorije prvi put došli u CERN i rekli nam: "Mi imamo takvu stvar", mi smo odgovorili: "Slušajte, to nije baš bilo koja stvar." Oni su nas poslušali i mada su postojali ti rezultati, punih sedam ili osam meseci oni nisu objavljeni. U tom periodu su izvršene brojne provere. I tom prilikom nisu nađene nikakve greške, pa smo zaključili da je bolje da budu objavljeni, da se predstave zajednici i da se više ljudi uključi u to. Ponekad to ni mediji ne razumeju. Jedan italijanski novinar je hteo da prenese vest sa naslovom kako "CERN izgovara sebe za grešku". Kad sam to video, rekao sam mu: "U redu, napiši tu stvar tako i čitaćeš o otkriću Higsa u ’Njujork tajmsu’." A stvar je u tome što on dobro zna i šta je OPERA i šta je CERN.

Morate priznati da je CERN na neki način prethodno garantovao da nije reč o grešci kao što je jedan isključeni kabl. Kako ste se vi lično osećali tog majskog jutra kad je trebalo da izađete i kažete novinarima da je merenje bilo pogrešno?

Nauka se doživljava kao nešto što mora uvek biti u pravu. Niјe tako. U nauci je mnogo važnije da uvek budem iskren, a ne u pravu. Dakle, ako samo prikazuјete svoјe uspehe, vi ne radite naučni posao. Ako pogledate saopštenje na tom seminaru i kako je rad napisan, u njemu nema tvrdnje o "otkriću". Tu je rečeno – imamo ovu opservaciju, ali ne tvrdimo ništa. Samo pozivamo širu zajednicu da to proveri. I mi u CERN-u smo se uključili. Ubedili smo ostale eksperimentatore na Gran Saso laboratoriji da i oni izvrše merenja brzine neutrina. Obezbedili smo novi sistem za sinhronizaciju vremena jer je to bilo važno. I to je trajalo nekoliko meseci. U međuvremenu, OPERA je pronašla svoju grešku sa tim kablom nakon ponovljenih merenja. To smo objavili na konferenciji u maju.
Da li autoritet CERN-a tu zaista nije bitan? Evo, na primer, svako od nas može da ispusti olovku. I kad vidi kako ona pada, kaže okej, sve je u redu sa Njutnovim zakonima gravitacije. Međutim, u savremenoj fizici niko od nas ne može da proveri vaše instrumente, da vidi da li su svi kablovi na mestu. Preostaje samo da verujemo u autoritet da CERN zna šta meri.

Bio sam tamo i mogu vam reći, to je ipak bilo jedno lepo merenje, izmerili su brzinu neutrina sa tačnošću jedan u milion. Nauka јe kada nastavljate i putem koјi ne ide pravo. Zapamtite važnu stvar: mi nismo religiјa. Mi smo religiјa sumnje. Nema stalnih istina. To nije moguće u nauci. Јer istina јe bila samo privremena. Nađete Higsa i sledeći korak je da nađete nova pitanja. Mi smo sveštenici sumnje, kreativne sumnje. I to je veoma važno, moramo da budemo iskreni sa rezultatima.

U šta ste vi lično verovali – da je Ajnštajn pogrešio?

Ne. Nisam lično verovao da je Ajnštajn pogrešio. Jedan eksperimentalni rezultat ne znači otkriće. Nisam verovao u to iz više razloga. Evo jednog – ako je tačan rezultat koji je OPERA dobila, šta ćemo sa merenjem supernove iz 1987? Da je to bilo tačno, neutrina bi sa te supernove morala da stignu godinama pre svetlosti do Zemlje.

OPERA Confirms: Neutrinos Travel Faster Than Light!!
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OPERA experiment sees neutrinos seem to beat speed of light


The OPERA experiment began in 2006 with the main goal of studying neutrino oscillation. Image courtesy of OPERA
The OPERA neutrino experiment announced today the kind of result that keeps a physicist up at night.

Scientists revealed that they have observed subatomic particles seeming to travel faster than the speed of light.

Leaders of the collaboration will share OPERA data with the world today at 9 a.m. CDT during a seminar to be broadcast live on the web. They have already posted the relevant paper online.

The OPERA experiment's study of more than 15,000 neutrino events over the course of three years indicated that the particles reached a velocity 20 parts per million above light speed.

If neutrinos really are breaking the cosmic speed limit, a revolution is at hand in the field of particle physics. Einstein’s law of special relativity as we understand it and a century of experiment tell scientists such a result is impossible.

So, to them, the next step is clear: They will try their best to prove it wrong.

“This result comes as a complete surprise,” said OPERA spokesperson Antonio Ereditato of the University of Bern. “After many months of studies and cross checks we have not found any instrumental effect that could explain the result of the measurement. While OPERA researchers will continue their studies, we are also looking forward to independent measurements to fully assess the nature of this observation.”

Neutrinos are some of the most mysterious particles studied today. They rarely interact with other matter, so they have the ability to slip quietly through space and entire planets as if they weren’t there. The only way scientists can detect enough of these subatomic ghosts to study their properties is to aim an intense beam of them at a large target.

OPERA is a long-baseline neutrino experiment, meaning that its detector sits far from its neutrino source. For the OPERA experiment, particles stream from their origins at CERN to Gran Sasso, Italy, more than 450 miles away. Long-baseline experiments allow scientists to study a strange trait of the particles. Neutrinos come in three types, called flavors. As they travel, neutrinos oscillate from one flavor to another.

These experiments can also take precision measurements such as the one announced today. Two other long-baseline neutrino experiments, one in the United States and the other in Japan, could double-check OPERA’s results. The MINOS experiment sends a beam of neutrinos from Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory into a 6,000-ton detector in a former iron mine about 450 miles away in northern Minnesota. The T2K experiment studies neutrinos that travel more than 180 miles through Japan from Tokai to Kamioka.

Previous results from the MINOS experiment do not contradict OPERA’s findings, but they are less certain. Scientists on the MINOS collaboration plan to improve the accuracy of their measurement with upgrades already underway.

Members of MINOS and T2K, along with scientists from around the world, will scrutinize the OPERA measurement, looking for fatal flaws. Still other scientists will prepare for another possibility: What if the result is right? “In the upcoming weeks, we’ll see a flurry of papers come out with different interpretations of this,” said CERN theoretical physicist John Ellis.

Not all theorists will jump in. Many will wait for confirmation by other experiments before taking on the problem of how to square superluminal neutrinos with the rest of physics.

But those that offer their interpretations will guide experimentalists by giving them new parameters to test, Ellis said. “It’s good to produce a bunch of reactions and see which way nature decides to go.”

Read updates:
Scientists still seek explanation for faster-than-light neutrino result
Faster-than-light neutrino result withstands new test

'Opera' experiment rerun confirms neutrinos are faster than light

Read more: http://digitaljournal.com/article/314640#ixzz28EIa5u43
Nov 21, 2011 - Scientific team refutes faster than light neutrino experiment

Read more: http://digitaljournal.com/article/314640#ixzz28EJ2BeO9

OPERA eksperiment u Laboratoriju Gran Sasso: neutrini putuju brže od svjetlosti?
Ured za odnose s javnošću IRB-a


Jučer je u CERN-u međunarodni tim znanstvenika objavio prve rezultate kompleksne i precizne analize podataka u okviru eksperimenta OPERA u čijoj su provedbi sudjelovali i znanstvenici s Instituta Ruđer Bošković: dr. sc. Ante Ljubičić, dr. sc. Mario Stipčević, dr. sc. Krešimir Jakovčić, dipl. inž. Budimir Kliček i dipl. inž. Julijan Babić. Analiza je provedena s ciljem da se, sa do sada neviđenom preciznošću, izmjeri brzina putovanja neutrina emitiranih iz CERN-a u 730 km udaljen podzemni laboratorij Gran Sasso.

Više od 15000 neutrina iz CERN-a stiglo je i detektirano u Laboratorij Gran Sasso 60 nano-sekundi prije nego što bi tu istu udaljenost prevalila svjetlost, što ukazuje da je brzina neutrina veća od brzine svjetlosti za približno 20 dijelova u milijun. Budu li ovi rezultati potvrđeni ovo otkriće će potkopati ključan element Opće teorije relativnosti Alberta Einsteina iz 1905. godine, koji kaže da ništa u svemiru ne može putovati brže od svjetlosti.

Spomenuti IRB-ovi znanstvenici radili su na svim fazama konstrukcije, ispitivanja i ugradnje inovativnih detektora čestica RPC i GRPC. Također, izradili su i nekoliko kompjutorskih programa za monitoriranje eksperimenta i za obradu mjerenih podataka. Time su znatno doprinijeli radu kolaboracije i postignutim rezultatima. Povremeno je na tom projektu radilo i desetak novaka i studenata fizike, koji su tako stjecali iskustva za rad u velikim međunarodnim eksperimentima. Treba istaknuti da suradnici Laboratorija za elektromagnetske i slabe interakcije iz ovog Zavoda imaju dvadesetak godina iskustva na problematici fizike neutrina, koje je započelo 1991. godine u CERN-u suosnivanjem eksperimenta NOMAD.

Speed-of-light experiment 'was wrong after all'
An experiment which appeared to contradict Einstein by showing that particles could travel faster than the speed of light is wrong after all, a rival group of scientists says.

By Nick Collins, Science Correspondent7:39PM GMT 21 Nov 201179 Comments
The claim comes from an independent team of researchers working at the Gran Sasso facility in Italy – the same laboratory as the group who shocked the world with their physics-defying announcement in September.
That experiment, known as OPERA, seemed to show that tiny particles known as neutrinos fired from the CERN research centre in Switzerland had arrived at Gran Sasso a fraction of a second faster than light would have done.
Because Einstein's theory of special relativity states that nothing can travel faster than light, the results run contrary to an assumption on which much of modern physics is based.
Proof that the OPERA team was correct would fundamentally alter our understanding the universe and raise the alarming possibility of time travel.
Amid widespread scepticism from the scientific community, the researchers challenged the world to prove them wrong, and last week announced they had run a slightly modified version of their experiment which produced the same result.
RELATED ARTICLES
CERN's neutrino experiment 23 Feb 2012
CERN scientists 'break the speed of light' 22 Sep 2011
Speed of light broken again as scientists test neutrino result 19 Nov 2011
Scientists' speed of light mistake 22 Feb 2012
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Tag Archives: OPERA neutrino experiment and it’s implications

February 22, 2012
The new glitch in OPERA Reply
Advocacy, anomaly, basic physics, experimental high energy physics, Ideas, Insights, manmohan dash, Methods, new experiment/theory results, open to review and publication, OPERA anomaly, OPERA experiment, particles and their properties, Physics, quantum mechanics, Relativity, Research, Research Article • Tags: crux of the matter, general relativity, gps clocks, OPERA Anomaly, opera experiment, OPERA neutrino, OPERA neutrino experiment and it's implications, techniical snags in experiments, theory of relativity
OPERA is wrong without this glitch as well. I have pinpointed this in many of my articles and one paper-communication. They have misinterpreted their result without much caution.
… Deb, when we talked a month or two ago, when you had called, I had given you the ideas I was testing then, namely Van Elburg’s fallacy and GPS system fallacy raised by some. Because GPS system works wonders. What did not was OPERA’s. MORE…

Koliko godina i koliko puta u tom vremenu je izvođen eksperiment "OPERA"?! Siguran sam da nije svaki put netko "pogrešno spojio kablove"! Mislim da je "spajanje kablova" netko osmislio u svojoj glavi (sumnja na Serđo Bertoluči - lično)! Sumnju mi nameće ova izjava S. Bertoluči:
Jedan italijanski novinar JE hteo da prenese prsluk sa naslovom kako "CERN izgovara sebe ZA grešku". Kad Sam na video, rekao Sam MU: "U redu, napiši tu stvar tako ja čitaćeš Ø otkriću Higsa U 'Njujork tajmsu'.
On PRIJETI, on ucjenjuje, on zna da će Higsov bozon biti otkriven!
Pitanje za sve slobodno misleće ljude: Ko je organizovao GLASANJE? Ko je rukovodio glasanjem? Kako je glasilo pitanje o kojem su se fizičari glasanjem izjašnjavali? Da li je bilo preglasavanja? Koliko glasova Za i koliko Protiv (ali čega - Za i čega - Protiv).
Ovim glasanjem nije branjena istina, već je branjena "istina"! Mislim da je ovdje bio prisutan tipičan slučaj iznude, prinude i ucjene!